Thanks Beth for your comments left on Saturday's post - I have to admit I took a sleeper last night ... but next time I'm awake at the wrong time I will think of you too!
I feel like I should be having cocoa and heading for bed now ... a storm has gathered right over our house, almost entirely blocking the sunlight. We live in spot where these things often are unable to find exit ... and the glass roof in the office is really taking a pounding. It's quite thrilling really ... how much more powerful a few hundred litres of water are than the sum of our manmade-backslapped production. By now the streets here will be impassable and people will be eyeing the river with suspicion. A good day to bond with the roof over my head. And be grateful that our house almost at the top of the quarry we live in.
I want to open my doors and invite our chickens, as well as assorted badgers, foxes, deer and squirrels to come shelter round the fire. Shame that half consider the other half lunch.
When I meditate at the moment I am aware of both movement and stillness in my thoughts. Hard to describe ... a virtual landslide on one side of the picture, but a calm acceptance and peace on the other. A part of me simply watching the territory rearranging like a scientist documenting a volcanic eruption.
I'm not sure on the whole public / private thing. On the one hand ... does it really matter (I have to tell myself firmly) that people know that I'm x, y, z? On the other hand, it feels a bit odd and I know that if it actually bit me in the real world - as with Ruth's bizarre email - I would find myself quite wobbled, and probably unable to see that my spelling was the least of the problems in that email. If it's all about awareness, surely there should be an awareness of the impact of randomly telling people off for minor oversights by email!? Perhaps we will begin receiving anonymous gifts of copies of Eats, Shoots and Leaves?
However, I have worked on forums where we eventually split the conversation into fully public and members only. I'm just a grateful recent joiner-inner so I'll be happy with any outcome.
Ruth - have you considered that perhaps flouncy-hair girl might be involved? If this was a soap-opera that would definitely be the next plot-twist ...
I've been thinking quite a lot about the public/private thing prompted by the email that Ruth received a few days ago; and about the responses that it has triggered from our little grouping. I find myself a bit challenged by the whole thing to be honest ...I have to confess that I had registered the way that Ruth spells Lorianne's name and also that in general, spelling and puncutation does matter to me (both in a rational and a twitchy sort of way)...however with this particular issue I supposed that it was Lorianne's call and since she didn't seem to mind then it didn't matter. I think it is horrible to feel suddenly and unexpectedly criticised; and I also think that apart from the nasty crack about meditation being about observation (oh really?) the email itself wasn't that awful - the writer (who I presume wasn't anonymous - that would make some difference) did point out they were cranky. Still what I am left with is that Ruth got hurt ...
...and yet this is a public group - and I'm aware that almost everyone overtly involved has a blog and those are also public. I feel upset that this grouping might become a forum and not open. This is because I belong to another forum and seen how a central clique forms, with its own norms and twitches that become rules that aren't allowed to be broken. I've also seen how people can be punished for breaking the rules. It feels important to me to know that there are people out there lurking who are variously committed to dropping by 100 Days - because, I suppose, it makes me feel less of an outsider too. One of the things that frightens me about groups is the "forming, storming, norming" that happens. It is inevitable in all groupings but speaking from general experience it is pants if you happen not to fit in with whatever norm is established or if you naturally feel always on the edge of whatever group you are part of ...
Thanks for stopping by bitteroot, and saying your piece (I hope you will stay?), Barbara too, about the public and inclusive nature of this blog. It's really important what you say.
For me, it wasn't the email per se that hurt, but that it brought up a fear of having a very private part of me judged by people I don't see here.
Lorainne's point hit home for me: "our lives are lived in front of others, so people can always look, judge, and criticize.". In one way I spend so much time on stage, and in groups, that perhaps there is a part of me that wants to curl up and be private with you guys (and whoever else wants to join). Ironically, spirituality has always been the most private aspect of my life, so perhaps this is what has come up.
That said, Bitteroot's point is a powerful enough one for me to keep going in this format, perhaps with a little more awareness on my part. How do you feel now, Beth?
Sat today becoming the soft autumn breeze. Bearing in mind Lorainne's last comment about the cat.
Lorainne - this is not said because I feel guilty about mispelling your name - I have to say your insights and the way you express them simply dazzle me. And thanks for all your humour about the whole thing.
By the way, when I got sick of my name sounding like something out of a Nazi rollcall or animals procreating, I just started asking everyone here in France to at least TRY and say the r and th. It's been better since then.
Barbara, sorry about the zillions of mispellings and lack of punctuation I know I have been guilty of! I often write late at night and feel so relaxed with this group that I let myself go a bit.
Ruth, I was really speaking out of a desire to protect you and protect the ability of the group to be as free and open as possible with one another. I agree with the people who said one of the great virtues of 100 Days is its openness and non-exclusivity - which, it seems to me, is what a spirituality forum should be. Bitteroot and Barbara both made important points that reinforce that. I really didn't know that what we were doing meant a lot to silent readers, and I am very glad to know that - and touched by it.
Maybe Ruth and I have somewhat more "public" personas than some other people here, where we feel more vulnerable - I could say something here that could show up in a review or article about my writing, for example - unlikely, but it's something I do think about when writing my own blog too. I say things here of a much more personal nature than I do over on my own site. But the long and short of it is yes, I'm willing to continue on as we have been.
I'm all for being public, though of course 'tiers' and 'back-channels' of involvement can never be completely avoided in online communities any more than they can in other kinds.
Beth and Ruth, I'm delighted that you're willing to continue on in an open site. For so many of us, you are fulfilling the original mission here, "the desire to help others keep their commitment to meditate."
Ruth, yes indeed I will stay, although I may still be rather quiet. Online, I mostly communicate in pictures.
However, I'm one who looks to all three dimensions of the "Buddha Dharma Sangha" thing to keep my practice alive, and I find all three present here. It is a refuge.
Bitterroot, that's so lovely to hear. And I'm delighted to know you and your beautiful blog, which I discovered when you left a comment on mine recently.
Bitterroot, I looked at your blog last night and this morning. I'm very happy to know about it. So much beauty.
Stray, thank you for the ways you make me laugh. Such a delight.
Barbara, you brought an interesting perspective with your experience with forums.
Ruth and Beth, thank you for your openness to openness. Beth, I, too, understand the concerns involved with maintaining a public position. There are potential ramifications for any of us who have not remained anonymous.
Jean is right, of course, that tiers etc can never be completely avoided. Seems to be the human way, and I am aware of such even on this blog. But far less here than could be, thanks to the awarenesses we keep, and, I think in part, the openness.
Most of all: (((Ruth))) I noticed the misspellings. I couldn't help it, I'm an editor/proofreader in another part of my life! But my brilliant and spelling-challenged child has taught me much about not imposing my spelling standards on others or making assumptions as to cause or solution in regard to misspellings. My theory was that it was your natural gravitation to a similar French name! But the why or how really doesn't matter to me. What I value is that your writing communicates a consistently thoughtful and loving, creative, compassionate, and inspiring mind. Thank you for being here.
Bitteroot, your pictures are very beautiful! Thank you for leading me there today.
And oh my dear, is it mistyping or do I have a real spelling problem? Apart from Lorainne's name (which I had honestly not noticed)I always thought it was because I was one glass of chateauneuf too far down the line, hitting the wrong keys and not worrying to preview and correct cos it was only you guys and you accepted me (do indeed accept me, it seems) as I am....! Anyway, thank you Jean for the hug and mb for your very warm words.
Beth you are absolutely right about the public face. I could too easily never be asked to play again.
Spent the day taking up lovely old terra cotta tiles in my room ready for the hemp floor (on to which they will return). At first I found myself so angry and frustrated - at what I have no idea - and breaking alot of them. J helped me change my attitude towards the tiles to one of loving kindness and consequently the activity became more of a meditation than a butchering.
After sitting earlier I had the most beautiful moment at one with my cat. I can't quite desribe the feeling of connection with nature, sitting with the flow in between my mountain and I and then all my senses being with Oscar... it made me think yet again how much richer life could be.
Hey, everyone (and welcome to Bitterroot, and good to see you, Barbara). Just a quick comment to say I've always thought of this site as being like a Zen Center, which opens its doors to anyone. That means you might meditate next to a very clear-minded veteran practitioner, or you might meditate next to a newbie who is constantly falling asleep & slouching into your space, or next to an almost-homeless person who just went off their psychiatric meds & could fly off the handle at any minute.
In other words, Zen Centers are practice places, but they aren't always peaceful.
In my experience, though, it isn't the new folks who are "just passing through" who typically are the biggest headache in a Zen Center: it's the folks you've been living & practicing with who have started to get on your nerves! So simply closing/locking the door doesn't eliminate judgment: it just means people in that "inner circle" would have ONLY OURSELVES to judge!
I think it is very clear we all want this to remain open. I just wanted to add that a forum would not be 'closed'. However, Barbara's description of hers sounds distinctly unattractive and I agree we're best off staying as we are! Nice analogy, Lorainne.
Also wanted to say that anyone else reading and practicing quietly along with us - please do not be put off by my little outburst!
I'm very sorry that Ruth had such an unpleasant experience. Ugh.
But it is a pleasure to read Bitteroots'contribution. Welcome. So glad you spoke up.
I too would not like 100 Days to go underground ... I am glad the consensus seems to be to leave it as it is.
Very tired. Have only sat briefly the last few days. When I get tired I can get ornery and rebellious and I therefore appreciated Dale's words a few days ago about keeping the pot stirred. The reminder came at the right time.
Thank you for your decision to keep the 'open to everyone' sign up and not replace it with 'exclusive'.
I've been with you since the start just quietly listening and learning and keeping warm:0). Lorianne your picture of the Zen centre made me really smile as I recognised my slumping homeless self and felt glad I was still welcome.
My spelling, grammar and punctuation come from the land of invention and creativity rarely protocol or acceptability but are more honest reflection of the writer than perfect prose so though I wish not to give anyone palpatations I hope they'll see the heart beyond the apparent oversights and inability to conform to a set norm.
As the almost homeless person I am glad I'm welcome to sit near the radiator and warm myself in the company of strangers who look beyond the odour, the irritablity and the odd snore and smile not in a putting up kind of way but with an acceptance of our similarities and the journey we're all on.
I read many of your blogs and sometimes even manage to leave a comment:0) but often will read and listen for a very long time before I feel able to say I'm there. Reason.... words take a long time to get from brain to fingers and blogs move at a faster pace than I can; I am aware that my use of language is often as clear as my brain function- cloudy at best stormy more often; I still have trouble getting my head round the 'speaking' to many as I comment to one. Not good in crowds of people as I find it difficult to follow multi strands so tend to listen and process quietly and be thankful in my heart but thought I must say thank you for letting me be here.
We seem to be having a problem in posting the new dates, and i wanted to let people know that some of us are still here! I don't have access to the posting, and don't know how to do it, but maybe someone who does will be able to shed some light on this.
Nicole, Daisy Winifred: thank you so much for being here and for saying how you feel. I've learned a lot from these recent comments - I don't think any of us realized so many people were probably reading and joining us in silence - but how perfect that is!
16 Comments:
Thanks Beth for your comments left on Saturday's post - I have to admit I took a sleeper last night ... but next time I'm awake at the wrong time I will think of you too!
I feel like I should be having cocoa and heading for bed now ... a storm has gathered right over our house, almost entirely blocking the sunlight. We live in spot where these things often are unable to find exit ... and the glass roof in the office is really taking a pounding. It's quite thrilling really ... how much more powerful a few hundred litres of water are than the sum of our manmade-backslapped production. By now the streets here will be impassable and people will be eyeing the river with suspicion. A good day to bond with the roof over my head. And be grateful that our house almost at the top of the quarry we live in.
I want to open my doors and invite our chickens, as well as assorted badgers, foxes, deer and squirrels to come shelter round the fire. Shame that half consider the other half lunch.
When I meditate at the moment I am aware of both movement and stillness in my thoughts. Hard to describe ... a virtual landslide on one side of the picture, but a calm acceptance and peace on the other. A part of me simply watching the territory rearranging like a scientist documenting a volcanic eruption.
I'm not sure on the whole public / private thing. On the one hand ... does it really matter (I have to tell myself firmly) that people know that I'm x, y, z? On the other hand, it feels a bit odd and I know that if it actually bit me in the real world - as with Ruth's bizarre email - I would find myself quite wobbled, and probably unable to see that my spelling was the least of the problems in that email. If it's all about awareness, surely there should be an awareness of the impact of randomly telling people off for minor oversights by email!? Perhaps we will begin receiving anonymous gifts of copies of Eats, Shoots and Leaves?
However, I have worked on forums where we eventually split the conversation into fully public and members only. I'm just a grateful recent joiner-inner so I'll be happy with any outcome.
Ruth - have you considered that perhaps flouncy-hair girl might be involved? If this was a soap-opera that would definitely be the next plot-twist ...
Love and huge hugs to all,
xx
I've been thinking quite a lot about the public/private thing prompted by the email that Ruth received a few days ago; and about the responses that it has triggered from our little grouping. I find myself a bit challenged by the whole thing to be honest ...I have to confess that I had registered the way that Ruth spells Lorianne's name and also that in general, spelling and puncutation does matter to me (both in a rational and a twitchy sort of way)...however with this particular issue I supposed that it was Lorianne's call and since she didn't seem to mind then it didn't matter. I think it is horrible to feel suddenly and unexpectedly criticised; and I also think that apart from the nasty crack about meditation being about observation (oh really?) the email itself wasn't that awful - the writer (who I presume wasn't anonymous - that would make some difference) did point out they were cranky. Still what I am left with is that Ruth got hurt ...
...and yet this is a public group - and I'm aware that almost everyone overtly involved has a blog and those are also public. I feel upset that this grouping might become a forum and not open. This is because I belong to another forum and seen how a central clique forms, with its own norms and twitches that become rules that aren't allowed to be broken. I've also seen how people can be punished for breaking the rules. It feels important to me to know that there are people out there lurking who are variously committed to dropping by 100 Days - because, I suppose, it makes me feel less of an outsider too. One of the things that frightens me about groups is the "forming, storming, norming" that happens. It is inevitable in all groupings but speaking from general experience it is pants if you happen not to fit in with whatever norm is established or if you naturally feel always on the edge of whatever group you are part of ...
Thanks for stopping by bitteroot, and saying your piece (I hope you will stay?), Barbara too, about the public and inclusive nature of this blog. It's really important what you say.
For me, it wasn't the email per se that hurt, but that it brought up a fear of having a very private part of me judged by people I don't see here.
Lorainne's point hit home for me:
"our lives are lived in front of others, so people can always look, judge, and criticize.". In one way I spend so much time on stage, and in groups, that perhaps there is a part of me that wants to curl up and be private with you guys (and whoever else wants to join). Ironically, spirituality has always been the most private aspect of my life, so perhaps this is what has come up.
That said, Bitteroot's point is a powerful enough one for me to keep going in this format, perhaps with a little more awareness on my part. How do you feel now, Beth?
Sat today becoming the soft autumn breeze. Bearing in mind Lorainne's last comment about the cat.
Lorainne - this is not said because I feel guilty about mispelling your name - I have to say your insights and the way you express them simply dazzle me. And thanks for all your humour about the whole thing.
By the way, when I got sick of my name sounding like something out of a Nazi rollcall or animals procreating, I just started asking everyone here in France to at least TRY and say the r and th. It's been better since then.
Barbara, sorry about the zillions of mispellings and lack of punctuation I know I have been guilty of! I often write late at night and feel so relaxed with this group that I let myself go a bit.
Ruth, I was really speaking out of a desire to protect you and protect the ability of the group to be as free and open as possible with one another. I agree with the people who said one of the great virtues of 100 Days is its openness and non-exclusivity - which, it seems to me, is what a spirituality forum should be. Bitteroot and Barbara both made important points that reinforce that. I really didn't know that what we were doing meant a lot to silent readers, and I am very glad to know that - and touched by it.
Maybe Ruth and I have somewhat more "public" personas than some other people here, where we feel more vulnerable - I could say something here that could show up in a review or article about my writing, for example - unlikely, but it's something I do think about when writing my own blog too. I say things here of a much more personal nature than I do over on my own site. But the long and short of it is yes, I'm willing to continue on as we have been.
I'm all for being public, though of course 'tiers' and 'back-channels' of involvement can never be completely avoided in online communities any more than they can in other kinds.
(((Ruth)))
Beth and Ruth, I'm delighted that you're willing to continue on in an open site. For so many of us, you are fulfilling the original mission here, "the desire to help others keep their commitment to meditate."
Ruth, yes indeed I will stay, although I may still be rather quiet. Online, I mostly communicate in pictures.
However, I'm one who looks to all three dimensions of the "Buddha Dharma Sangha" thing to keep my practice alive, and I find all three present here. It is a refuge.
Bitterroot, that's so lovely to hear. And I'm delighted to know you and your beautiful blog, which I discovered when you left a comment on mine recently.
Bitterroot, I looked at your blog last night and this morning. I'm very happy to know about it. So much beauty.
Stray, thank you for the ways you make me laugh. Such a delight.
Barbara, you brought an interesting perspective with your experience with forums.
Ruth and Beth, thank you for your openness to openness. Beth, I, too, understand the concerns involved with maintaining a public position. There are potential ramifications for any of us who have not remained anonymous.
Jean is right, of course, that tiers etc can never be completely avoided. Seems to be the human way, and I am aware of such even on this blog. But far less here than could be, thanks to the awarenesses we keep, and, I think in part, the openness.
Most of all: (((Ruth)))
I noticed the misspellings. I couldn't help it, I'm an editor/proofreader in another part of my life! But my brilliant and spelling-challenged child has taught me much about not imposing my spelling standards on others or making assumptions as to cause or solution in regard to misspellings. My theory was that it was your natural gravitation to a similar French name! But the why or how really doesn't matter to me. What I value is that your writing communicates a consistently thoughtful and loving, creative, compassionate, and inspiring mind. Thank you for being here.
Bitteroot, your pictures are very beautiful! Thank you for leading me there today.
And oh my dear, is it mistyping or do I have a real spelling problem? Apart from Lorainne's name (which I had honestly not noticed)I always thought it was because I was one glass of chateauneuf too far down the line, hitting the wrong keys and not worrying to preview and correct cos it was only you guys and you accepted me (do indeed accept me, it seems) as I am....! Anyway, thank you Jean for the hug and mb for your very warm words.
Beth you are absolutely right about the public face. I could too easily never be asked to play again.
Spent the day taking up lovely old terra cotta tiles in my room ready for the hemp floor (on to which they will return). At first I found myself so angry and frustrated - at what I have no idea - and breaking alot of them. J helped me change my attitude towards the tiles to one of loving kindness and consequently the activity became more of a meditation than a butchering.
After sitting earlier I had the most beautiful moment at one with my cat. I can't quite desribe the feeling of connection with nature, sitting with the flow in between my mountain and I and then all my senses being with Oscar... it made me think yet again how much richer life could be.
Hey, everyone (and welcome to Bitterroot, and good to see you, Barbara). Just a quick comment to say I've always thought of this site as being like a Zen Center, which opens its doors to anyone. That means you might meditate next to a very clear-minded veteran practitioner, or you might meditate next to a newbie who is constantly falling asleep & slouching into your space, or next to an almost-homeless person who just went off their psychiatric meds & could fly off the handle at any minute.
In other words, Zen Centers are practice places, but they aren't always peaceful.
In my experience, though, it isn't the new folks who are "just passing through" who typically are the biggest headache in a Zen Center: it's the folks you've been living & practicing with who have started to get on your nerves! So simply closing/locking the door doesn't eliminate judgment: it just means people in that "inner circle" would have ONLY OURSELVES to judge!
I guess this isn't a quick comment after all!
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Ooops, that delete was me: I had trouble with word-verification & posted twice...
I think it is very clear we all want this to remain open. I just wanted to add that a forum would not be 'closed'. However, Barbara's description of hers sounds distinctly unattractive and I agree we're best off staying as we are! Nice analogy, Lorainne.
Also wanted to say that anyone else reading and practicing quietly along with us - please do not be put off by my little outburst!
I'm very sorry that Ruth had such an unpleasant experience. Ugh.
But it is a pleasure to read Bitteroots'contribution. Welcome.
So glad you spoke up.
I too would not like 100 Days to go underground ... I am glad the consensus seems to be to leave it as it is.
Very tired. Have only sat briefly the last few days. When I get tired I can get ornery and rebellious and I therefore appreciated Dale's words a few days ago about keeping the pot stirred. The reminder came at the right time.
Thank you for your decision to keep the 'open to everyone' sign up and not replace it with 'exclusive'.
I've been with you since the start just quietly listening and learning and keeping warm:0). Lorianne your picture of the Zen centre made me really smile as I recognised my slumping homeless self and felt glad I was still welcome.
My spelling, grammar and punctuation come from the land of invention and creativity rarely protocol or acceptability but are more honest reflection of the writer than perfect prose so though I wish not to give anyone palpatations I hope they'll see the heart beyond the apparent oversights and inability to conform to a set norm.
As the almost homeless person I am glad I'm welcome to sit near the radiator and warm myself in the company of strangers who look beyond the odour, the irritablity and the odd snore and smile not in a putting up kind of way but with an acceptance of our similarities and the journey we're all on.
I read many of your blogs and sometimes even manage to leave a comment:0) but often will read and listen for a very long time before I feel able to say I'm there. Reason.... words take a long time to get from brain to fingers and blogs move at a faster pace than I can; I am aware that my use of language is often as clear as my brain function- cloudy at best stormy more often; I still have trouble getting my head round the 'speaking' to many as I comment to one.
Not good in crowds of people as I find it difficult to follow multi strands so tend to listen and process quietly and be thankful in my heart but thought I must say thank you for letting me be here.
We seem to be having a problem in posting the new dates, and i wanted to let people know that some of us are still here! I don't have access to the posting, and don't know how to do it, but maybe someone who does will be able to shed some light on this.
Nicole, Daisy Winifred: thank you so much for being here and for saying how you feel. I've learned a lot from these recent comments - I don't think any of us realized so many people were probably reading and joining us in silence - but how perfect that is!
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