Ruth, I'm thinking of Gail and her kids. I remember a very moving, very honest piece she wrote when her ex first told her about his illness. Your mention sent me to her blog for the first time in a while, and to read the wonderful piece she wrote quite recently about moving to the country: http://www.openbrackets.com/article/792/#comment It's good to know that in these hard times she's in a place that gives her such peace and solace.
Why do you think people find you irksome, Brenda? Because they don't reply to everything you say? If I don't reply, it's just that I'm interested (always interested!), but don't have time to write a lengthy response. My computer time, time for anything, is always too limited, because I spend most of my waking hours working or commuting. If that is what's upsetting you, I understand - why bother to share so much of yourself if you're getting a lot less back? But I don't think it means that anyone finds you irksome! I love your experience and attitude to meditation. Monkey mind, and much else, is amusing, rather than a deadly serious problem, to me too, even though other aspects of meditation are sometimes a painful (though welcome) journey for me. I think there's a continuum here, not a flock of white sheep and one black one. As I said, though, I do very much understand if you feel you're not getting back the in-depth discussion you would wish for. If that's it, I would hope perhaps you wouldn't leave altogether - I would miss you so much. But, well, whatever you need, and needs do evolve. Lots of love.
I don't know what you said Brenda, but the suggestion brings something up for me about this little community of ours. I would like to to feel that I do not have to respond to everyone's comments. I would like instead to allow myself to respond naturally when and where I feel moved to do so. Something I have begun to feel recently is a sense of guilt that I do not 'respond' to everyone, but for me that feels more like a therapy group, and that is not why I, personally, am here. In a funny way it's what I am trying to get away from!
Something which I believe is always good is to come back to writing here about our actual experience of meditation. If something touches me that someone has said I will respond but otherwise, I would like to feel free not to, and just rest in the knowledge that we are all here for each other. I would like to feel I can come here and speak about my practice, and deepen my practice by hearing of other people's experiences without having to go through responding to where everyone is at in their life story....is this OK with everyone?
This discussion today (with removed comments I didn't see) leaves me confused and concerned. Not sure what it's about. But Brenda, nothing you've posted here has felt "irksome" to me, or otherwise irritating. Always interesting, even when I don't respond, which I know I often don't. Most of my comments here also go unresponded to, except when I've made a clearcut appeal, and then the response has been very supportive. And truthfully, I think many of us feel we are black sheep, whether in terms of meditation or other matters. I would miss you if you left, if that's what you are considering.
Ruth, we cross-posted. I hear what you are saying and want to clarify that what I said about comments not being responded to is not a complaint, just observation that it's a common phenomenon here.
Missed all that. I shall consign it to my growing pile of confusing things I must try not to worry about :)
Janice - what an amazing quote!
Ruth, I'm thinking of your friend. Great blog as well ... new to me ...
Monkey minded indeed today. Have tied myself in knots over something which is neither unimportant nor the end of the world. One of those situations where no matter which way the coin lands, the decision feels not-right. I am not good with situations which cannot be resolved ... and yet this situation is one of those precisely. I am trying to soothe my scrambled brain with the idea that it is good practice at tolerating something which feels intolerable. Hmph.
Meanwhile, to lighten the mood, here at my house, which has always had a touch of the shining about it, my slightly peculiar housemate has taken her OCD to a new level. Apparently, our due-to-arrive 3rd chicken is going to cause her great distress. I kid you not, she proclaims that "2 chickens is fine, 4 chickens is fine, 3 chickens is REALLY upsetting". Something about odd numbers and poultry. So upsetting that, having failed to get the chicken revoked by way of an enormous tantrum, she has vowed to have nothing to do with the chickens once the third one arrives. And claims she will have to stop eating eggs. She is a vegetarian of limited cooking repertoire and currently eats little else. I'm afraid I muttered something about nonsense only partially under my breath. Cue world war three. Deep breaths. Deep breaths. My other housemate has tourettes (not the swearing kind) ... and mostly makes chicken noises. Which is sending me into choking hysteria every 2 minutes. Housemate 1 sees this a provocation. Would somebody like to send a documentary crew?
Ditto those who have said such wise and well phrased things ... some stuff I feel I can respond to, other times I just read and nod and hold someone in mind for a moment but have nothing useful or pertinent to say. Don't mean I don't care. Etc. And I for one would be delighted to think that people only found me irksome!
Just logged on here so I haven't seen the deleted comments either.
Brenda, not sure what the problem is (and you are definitely not irksome!) but I hope you don't go altogether. Even if you go elsewhere as well I hope you would always feel able to call in here now and then. I have learned much from your experience of different types of meditation - something I don't have. And I have always been interested in the points you raise even if I don't have the ability or knowledge to respond fully. Indeed I have frequently had doubts about whether I should be participating here because I don't really 'fit in' or 'belong'. So I was deeply comforted to read the earlier comments about 'black sheep'. Yup, that's me.
I agree that it is not always possible to 'respond' to everyone. And I agree too that the primary purpose of this place is to share re our meditation practice. I love to read and share myself about other things as well .... but it isn't always possible to respond to everything that's raised. Ruth has put it very well, i.e.
..(we) rest in the knowledge that we are all here for each other.
I am just so pleased to be sitting regularly at the moment! Much of this is down to the support and solidity of 100 Days.
Love to all. As it happens I was thinking of Devon this morning after sitting and hoping that all is well.
Yes, I'm another one who just arrived at the party only to find a weird dark cloud over the place. Deleted comments? Repeated references to whether or not Brenda is irksome? What the heck's going on here?
I've skimmed back through the several days while I was gone, and I'm not sure what text/subtext I'm missing. So like Stray, "I shall consign it to my growing pile of confusing things I must try not to worry about."
Brenda, I don't know what's going on, but I for one don't think you or your comments are "irksome." Like Jean, I sometimes (usually) don't have time to respond in-depth to everything everyone's shared; teaching online as I do, I already feel I spend far too much time in front of my computer. But as Jean said, my sometimes-silence doesn't imply annoyance...I simply sometimes don't know what to say, so I don't.
I don't know what's going on either! I hope that we all feel supportive of one another and that we can accept whatever responses or semi- or non-responses we receive here in that spirit. It seems so clear to me that we all wish the best for one another, and that there is no ill feeling or annoyance between us, and I'd hate to burden that with some overlay of greater expectations. We all go through periods of being lonelier or needier or stronger or more self-sufficient than at other times - that's just a given - and I know when I'm feeling alone it's very hard to feel the connections. I've also experienced the feeling of putting myself "out there" and not getting back something that felt commensurate - in fact this is something I've tried to "practice with" over time. When the shoe is on the other foot, sometimes I suppose I respond appropriately and adequately, and sometimes I just can't, for simple lack of time and energy. It certainly doesn't mean I don't care, or that I'm not interested, and that's what I assume about other people in regard to what I express, too. Showing up here is a reflection of practice - we're still here, we still care, and that's a lot.
Posting on Wednesday morning 8am in Edinburgh, and for the first time in ages. Having, like most people no real clear idea of what is going on here I still want to say - I don't read everyone's comments every time I check in - I skim different people at different times; sometimes I read everything fully. All of this depends on how I am feeling, as does whether or not I post/respond. I experience a wide range of feelings towards the things that are said here and towards everyone who posts - this also depends on how I feel ...I frequently 'fail' to respond or to comment because of how I am in groups (virtual or otherwise) and how painful I find it to be in groups. In some ways a virtual group such as this can foster more traumas for me and sometimes I back away because I imagine I am excluded (black sheep? so many of us seem to feel it)...and then I think how would any of you know since I don't comment much and don't talk about how I feel. So - Oh Brenda I wish you had left your comments ...and I know it takes a lot of courage to post about feelings and then feel that you aren't responded to; and that you might want something more or different from what you get here ...
Well, I've been very self-absorbed for the past couple weeks as my job problems came to a head, so if I've been unresponsive, that's where it comes from, on my side. Ditto on what everyone's said. I am entirely un-irked and baffled about what I should ever have been irked about. But anyway -- I really would like this to be a space without high expectations of response -- for me it's really valuable to have a space where I can just say if I'm sitting or not and what I'm trying or failing at. It just keeps, as my lama says, the pot stirred. I don't recollect *ever* having been irked by anything anyone's said here, which actually is pretty astonishing.
16 Comments:
Ruth, I'm thinking of Gail and her kids. I remember a very moving, very honest piece she wrote when her ex first told her about his illness. Your mention sent me to her blog for the first time in a while, and to read the wonderful piece she wrote quite recently about moving to the country: http://www.openbrackets.com/article/792/#comment
It's good to know that in these hard times she's in a place that gives her such peace and solace.
What a terrible time for Gail and her husband and children! My heart with them, in the way it can be for those you don't know.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Why do you think people find you irksome, Brenda? Because they don't reply to everything you say? If I don't reply, it's just that I'm interested (always interested!), but don't have time to write a lengthy response. My computer time, time for anything, is always too limited, because I spend most of my waking hours working or commuting. If that is what's upsetting you, I understand - why bother to share so much of yourself if you're getting a lot less back? But I don't think it means that anyone finds you irksome! I love your experience and attitude to meditation. Monkey mind, and much else, is amusing, rather than a deadly serious problem, to me too, even though other aspects of meditation are sometimes a painful (though welcome) journey for me. I think there's a continuum here, not a flock of white sheep and one black one. As I said, though, I do very much understand if you feel you're not getting back the in-depth discussion you would wish for. If that's it, I would hope perhaps you wouldn't leave altogether - I would miss you so much. But, well, whatever you need, and needs do evolve. Lots of love.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Jean, it's more than that. No, actual responses wouldn't bother me at all if that were only the case.
Anyway, I've deleted my comments. Not a worthy subject.
xo
Brenda, I read your first post today before it was deleted, but I don't know what the second one said. Anyway, this quotation today comes from Ginkgo
"Could a greater miracle take place than for us to look through each other's eyes for an instant?" -- Henry David Thoreau
I don't know what you said Brenda, but the suggestion brings something up for me about this little community of ours. I would like to to feel that I do not have to respond to everyone's comments. I would like instead to allow myself to respond naturally when and where I feel moved to do so. Something I have begun to feel recently is a sense of guilt that I do not 'respond' to everyone, but for me that feels more like a therapy group, and that is not why I, personally, am here. In a funny way it's what I am trying to get away from!
Something which I believe is always good is to come back to writing here about our actual experience of meditation. If something touches me that someone has said I will respond but otherwise, I would like to feel free not to, and just rest in the knowledge that we are all here for each other. I would like to feel I can come here and speak about my practice, and deepen my practice by hearing of other people's experiences without having to go through responding to where everyone is at in their life story....is this OK with everyone?
This discussion today (with removed comments I didn't see) leaves me confused and concerned. Not sure what it's about. But Brenda, nothing you've posted here has felt "irksome" to me, or otherwise irritating. Always interesting, even when I don't respond, which I know I often don't. Most of my comments here also go unresponded to, except when I've made a clearcut appeal, and then the response has been very supportive. And truthfully, I think many of us feel we are black sheep, whether in terms of meditation or other matters. I would miss you if you left, if that's what you are considering.
Ruth, we cross-posted. I hear what you are saying and want to clarify that what I said about comments not being responded to is not a complaint, just observation that it's a common phenomenon here.
Missed all that. I shall consign it to my growing pile of confusing things I must try not to worry about :)
Janice - what an amazing quote!
Ruth, I'm thinking of your friend. Great blog as well ... new to me ...
Monkey minded indeed today. Have tied myself in knots over something which is neither unimportant nor the end of the world. One of those situations where no matter which way the coin lands, the decision feels not-right. I am not good with situations which cannot be resolved ... and yet this situation is one of those precisely. I am trying to soothe my scrambled brain with the idea that it is good practice at tolerating something which feels intolerable. Hmph.
Meanwhile, to lighten the mood, here at my house, which has always had a touch of the shining about it, my slightly peculiar housemate has taken her OCD to a new level. Apparently, our due-to-arrive 3rd chicken is going to cause her great distress. I kid you not, she proclaims that "2 chickens is fine, 4 chickens is fine, 3 chickens is REALLY upsetting". Something about odd numbers and poultry. So upsetting that, having failed to get the chicken revoked by way of an enormous tantrum, she has vowed to have nothing to do with the chickens once the third one arrives. And claims she will have to stop eating eggs. She is a vegetarian of limited cooking repertoire and currently eats little else. I'm afraid I muttered something about nonsense only partially under my breath. Cue world war three. Deep breaths. Deep breaths. My other housemate has tourettes (not the swearing kind) ... and mostly makes chicken noises. Which is sending me into choking hysteria every 2 minutes. Housemate 1 sees this a provocation. Would somebody like to send a documentary crew?
Ditto those who have said such wise and well phrased things ... some stuff I feel I can respond to, other times I just read and nod and hold someone in mind for a moment but have nothing useful or pertinent to say. Don't mean I don't care. Etc. And I for one would be delighted to think that people only found me irksome!
Love to all xx
Just logged on here so I haven't seen the deleted comments either.
Brenda, not sure what the problem is (and you are definitely not irksome!) but I hope you don't go altogether. Even if you go elsewhere as well I hope you would always feel able to call in here now and then. I have learned much from your experience of different types of meditation - something I don't have. And I have always been interested in the points you raise even if I don't have the ability or knowledge to respond fully. Indeed I have frequently had doubts about whether I should be participating here because I don't really 'fit in' or 'belong'. So I was deeply comforted to read the earlier comments about 'black sheep'. Yup, that's me.
I agree that it is not always possible to 'respond' to everyone. And I agree too that the primary purpose of this place is to share re our meditation practice. I love to read and share myself about other things as well .... but it isn't always possible to respond to everything that's raised. Ruth has put it very well, i.e.
..(we) rest in the knowledge that we are all here for each other.
I am just so pleased to be sitting regularly at the moment! Much of this is down to the support and solidity of 100 Days.
Love to all. As it happens I was thinking of Devon this morning after sitting and hoping that all is well.
Yes, I'm another one who just arrived at the party only to find a weird dark cloud over the place. Deleted comments? Repeated references to whether or not Brenda is irksome? What the heck's going on here?
I've skimmed back through the several days while I was gone, and I'm not sure what text/subtext I'm missing. So like Stray, "I shall consign it to my growing pile of confusing things I must try not to worry about."
Brenda, I don't know what's going on, but I for one don't think you or your comments are "irksome." Like Jean, I sometimes (usually) don't have time to respond in-depth to everything everyone's shared; teaching online as I do, I already feel I spend far too much time in front of my computer. But as Jean said, my sometimes-silence doesn't imply annoyance...I simply sometimes don't know what to say, so I don't.
I don't know what's going on either! I hope that we all feel supportive of one another and that we can accept whatever responses or semi- or non-responses we receive here in that spirit. It seems so clear to me that we all wish the best for one another, and that there is no ill feeling or annoyance between us, and I'd hate to burden that with some overlay of greater expectations. We all go through periods of being lonelier or needier or stronger or more self-sufficient than at other times - that's just a given - and I know when I'm feeling alone it's very hard to feel the connections. I've also experienced the feeling of putting myself "out there" and not getting back something that felt commensurate - in fact this is something I've tried to "practice with" over time. When the shoe is on the other foot, sometimes I suppose I respond appropriately and adequately, and sometimes I just can't, for simple lack of time and energy. It certainly doesn't mean I don't care, or that I'm not interested, and that's what I assume about other people in regard to what I express, too. Showing up here is a reflection of practice - we're still here, we still care, and that's a lot.
Posting on Wednesday morning 8am in Edinburgh, and for the first time in ages. Having, like most people no real clear idea of what is going on here I still want to say - I don't read everyone's comments every time I check in - I skim different people at different times; sometimes I read everything fully. All of this depends on how I am feeling, as does whether or not I post/respond. I experience a wide range of feelings towards the things that are said here and towards everyone who posts - this also depends on how I feel ...I frequently 'fail' to respond or to comment because of how I am in groups (virtual or otherwise) and how painful I find it to be in groups. In some ways a virtual group such as this can foster more traumas for me and sometimes I back away because I imagine I am excluded (black sheep? so many of us seem to feel it)...and then I think how would any of you know since I don't comment much and don't talk about how I feel. So - Oh Brenda I wish you had left your comments ...and I know it takes a lot of courage to post about feelings and then feel that you aren't responded to; and that you might want something more or different from what you get here ...
Well, I've been very self-absorbed for the past couple weeks as my job problems came to a head, so if I've been unresponsive, that's where it comes from, on my side. Ditto on what everyone's said. I am entirely un-irked and baffled about what I should ever have been irked about. But anyway -- I really would like this to be a space without high expectations of response -- for me it's really valuable to have a space where I can just say if I'm sitting or not and what I'm trying or failing at. It just keeps, as my lama says, the pot stirred. I don't recollect *ever* having been irked by anything anyone's said here, which actually is pretty astonishing.
xoxo to you all --
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